Laser Module Performance

pjkoths
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:46 pm
Model of CNC Machine: Highly Modified Shark HD510
Location: Marysville, WA

Laser Module Performance

Post by pjkoths »

Hello all -
I hope someone might be able to shed some light on why the time it takes to laser a 185kb photo, 5" x 5.5" is taking hours. Currently it is taking approximately 16 hours to accomplish the photo engrave.

I have a Shark HD5 using the most current Vcarve Pro software with laser module and all current PP's. I am using a Shark 7w laser, kerf at .01" with speed set at 100"/min and 100% power.

File at:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1pMGdj8 ... sp=sharing

Any help would be appreciated.

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

Downloaded your file to take a quick look.

The time is most likely from your line spacing.
From what I see it is set at 0.003.
The denser the line spacing the longer it is going to take.

I will be doing some photo laser work in the next week or so, as I wait for these guys to resolve the problems with hatching.
I will post any successes or failures.

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

Did some testing today:
Again I'm using Aspire 10.5 - Latest update.
Shark HD5 with 7 watt laser.
I use the 6 watt laser (inch) provided in the software for tool paths and have PP - Next Wave - Laser (inch)(*.tap)
Material - 4"x4" Beechwood (I think). Cheap coasters available on line.

Test - 1
Max Laser 100% Min 0%
Speed - 90"/min.
Line Spacing - 0.0102
Kerf - 0.0105
Result - Major charred line. Stopped it after a couple minutes.

Test - 2
Reduced max laser to Max=20%
Speed 100"/min.
Line spacing and kerf stayed the same.
Result - Heavy heavy burned line, Stopped it after a couple minutes.

Test - 3
Max laser = 15%
Speed 130"/min.
Line spacing = 0.02
20210125_193928.jpg
Result - No hard charring. Still quite dark. (time 1:05:44 - 50% complete before stopped).

Test - 4
Max laser = 12%
Speed = 135"/min.
Line spacing = 0.02
20210125_194535.jpg
Result = Not to bad. not what I want though. (time to complete - 2:07:57).

Notes: I made no adjustments to the photo. Photo stats: 2208x2944 - 72 dpi. I strongly recommend adjusting the contrast and brightness to achieve the results you desire. Although the photo may look distorted to you, the laser may make it quite nice. (Vectric has some good videos on how to do that).

Also, by having to adjust my max laser to >20%, I will see no preview when I hit "Preview All Toolpaths". ie. No image will be produced on the screen. To see the image I have to adjust the max level back to 100, view it for location etc, then reduce the max back below 20%.

I have both Vcarve Pro and Aspire. I have had issues the whole time trying to utilize the laser. Unless I want to start a fire, I do not use my laser much above 22%. I have not used wood any harder then red oak and no slate or tile... yet. I have stacks of coasters with different images burned into them with the settings used. (Had to do all over when I got the laser module). For the bamboo cutting boards for instance, I run my laser between 15-20%. Here is a post showing issues I'm having. It also shows some work and the settings.

viewtopic.php?f=61&t=36619

I will continue to test (maybe tomorrow) and again post my results. I hope this helps some out there also having issues with Shark HD and laser results. If anyone sees any errors I have made, or has any advise on adjustment I should try, please feel free to pass them along and I will happily try it. I am very very green with this software and CNC so I need all the help I can get.

EdwardP
Vectric Staff
Posts: 79
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2005 9:29 am

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by EdwardP »

Hi pj & Auger,

I'm afraid that you are right that we are having trouble getting acceptable photo etching results from the Shark series and I must apologise for the fact that these issues were not identified before the release of the Laser Module. You may have noted that, for the moment, we have withdrawn the Shark series from our list of supported hardware options for laser. I'd like to take this opportunity to ask any Shark customers considering purchasing our Laser Module to hold-off for now please. If you are a Shark customer and have already purchased the Laser Module please do get in touch with our support team if you are unhappy with it specifically because of this photo etching issue. That said, we are determined to resolve this problem as quickly and effectively as we can.

We bought our own Piranha and laser kit last month and Mark (who many of you will know) has been able to work directly on this problem for the last couple of weeks. The fundamental issue is that we are using entirely conventional gcode to send the laser etching movements and this results in an extremely dense toolpath - equivalent to a highly detailed 3D finishing pass over a complex 3D surface. At the moment it appears that we are simply overwhelming the controller with instructions and some aspects of 'downstream' power control are out of our hands.

I want to highlight that Nextwave do offer their own laser solution specifically for simple rastering of photos over a level surface. It uses a proprietary and heavily compressed data format and this largely bypasses the problems we are having - if you are wanting a simple and immediate solution right now, please do consider this option.

At Vectric, however, we are going to persevere with our approach a little longer because we believe it will ultimately offer a more integrated and flexible solution. By using conventional gcode we can produce complex 3D laser paths that follow the contours of a previously carved piece, we can offer an near infinite number of laser patterns (not just raster stripes) and the photo can be fully and seamlessly incorporated into your design alongside other elements of either laser etching or router carving. These are all crucial aspects of our vision for the Laser Module within Aspire and VCarve and we will continue to work hard to deliver them for Shark customers too.

The guys at Nextwave have been extremely responsive to our requests for help and we are already working on a joint project to optimise, significantly, the gcode we create and the controller's responses to it. As you can imagine, implementing and rolling-out firmware changes to support us is a really big ask and must be done methodically and with care. It may take a little time, but we're very grateful to Nextwave for working with us on this.

In the meantime, can I ask @Auger if you would be willing to work with Mark as an external tester on this issue? If so would you drop us a line at support@vectric.com and we'll hook you up?

I realise that this is a problem, but I want to be as open and honest about our actions to try and address it. Thank you in advance for your patience.

Edward

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

Being retired means I have nothing but time on my hands.

I would be more then willing to do any testing you ask of me. I did buy the laser module for mainly photo burning. I want to personally thank you for the reply. I know I am not alone, and I want to help those others also experiencing these problems.

I have sent contact information to suppost@vectirc.com and look forward assisting you.

Auger

pjkoths
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:46 pm
Model of CNC Machine: Highly Modified Shark HD510
Location: Marysville, WA

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by pjkoths »

Hello Auger & Edward -
Thank you for your help and replies on this issue.

If there is anything I might be able to do to help - let me know.

Also retired so everyday is Saturday.

Pete

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

Got an e-mail from Next Wave confirming the Kerf for the 7 watt laser being 0.01

My kerf was set incorrectly. I believe the default for the 6 watt listed is 0.15. Sorry if that messed anyone up.

I have made the change in my projects and will continue to test.

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

Sorry typo above. Kerf setting default on the 6 watt laser is set to 0.015, not 0.15.

hmatyas
Vectric Apprentice
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:49 am
Model of CNC Machine: Shark HD3

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by hmatyas »

Hi

Has the problem with the Shark HD4 and HD5 been resolved? I purchased the laser module and I have a Shark HD3.
I know that it does not work with the HD3 but was looking into acquiring a HD5 controller. However, it looks like this would not be wise because it appears that the HD5 controller does not work as it should. Is this correct?

Thank you.

User avatar
Rcnewcomb
Vectric Archimage
Posts: 5864
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 5:54 am
Model of CNC Machine: 24x36 GCnC/WinCNC with ATC
Location: San Jose, California, USA
Contact:

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Rcnewcomb »

hmatyas,

You may wish to send your question directly to support@vectric.com for an official answer. The user forum is primarily for support from other users although Vectric employees do drop by and respond from time to time.
- Randall Newcomb
10 fingers in, 10 fingers out, another good day in the shop

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

At this time I have not gotten any resolutions to the laser module and Shark lasers. I have had a ticket in since January, but have received little or no reply.

I have spoken/e-mailed both Vectric and Next Wave Automation.

Was told it would be a couple months in January. Recently asked for an ETA, but no reply.

hmatyas
Vectric Apprentice
Posts: 96
Joined: Sun Sep 06, 2015 2:49 am
Model of CNC Machine: Shark HD3

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by hmatyas »

Thank you for both replies, I guess I will just sit back and wait. At least I did not buy a controller thinking that it would solve the problem.

Auger
Posts: 33
Joined: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:47 am
Model of CNC Machine: Next Wave Automation HD5 Extended Bed

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Auger »

Not sure if you can put an HD5 controller on an HD3, that's a Next Wave Automation question. I'm guessing you could, but would verify with them to be sure.

The issues I've seen only come from the laser module. And they are not consistent in my opinion. I have used the laser on multiple projects and have had outstanding results. Others not so outstanding.

My issues are when cross-hatching, and photos. A solution suggested in the mean time is to use the Next Waves Ready2Raster program available from their web site for free. I may try a couple small projects this week and see if I have better luck then last time. This would be a temporary fix to photos, but nothing for my bigger projects with hatching.

As soon as I hear something form either company, I will make a post in the forums.

schafferbg
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2021 5:33 pm
Model of CNC Machine: SHARK HD5

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by schafferbg »

I have an HD5, got excited about the laser module, then Vectric told me that it wasn't supported for my machine. Axiom tells me the laser module grayscale does not work on their machines. just curious - what machines are supported?

User avatar
Adrian
Vectric Archimage
Posts: 14503
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2006 2:19 pm
Model of CNC Machine: ShopBot PRS Alpha 96x48
Location: Surrey, UK

Re: Laser Module Performance

Post by Adrian »

schafferbg wrote:
Sun Apr 04, 2021 11:30 pm
I have an HD5, got excited about the laser module, then Vectric told me that it wasn't supported for my machine. Axiom tells me the laser module grayscale does not work on their machines. just curious - what machines are supported?
See the FAQ headed "What laser hardware is compatible with the laser module?" at the bottom of the page here - https://www.vectric.com/products/laser-module

Post Reply