Changing BOB and Mach3

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Leo
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Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by Leo »

I am thinking about changing Mach 3 - and - my Breakout board.

What control software do you use?

Why do you like it?

Why do you hate it?
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rig gap
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by rig gap »

Leo...I just changed from Mach 3 to the Centroid Acorn board with CNC 12 control software...figuring everything out for the change was in reality pretty straight forward, but I also changed my Chinese drivers to a Gecko 540 drive and remounted all of it to a new board with new wiring and better air circulation.
My steppers now run considerably faster (300 ipm verses 185 ipm) without skipping steps, tool touch-off in x,y,and z are easily done as well as tool changes with automatic z zero...plus it supports lasers, digitizers and probing, also runs all the normal g-code canned cycles, and has built in conversational programming.
Even though programs copied from Mach 3 to Centroid have the sam speeds and feeds, the Centroid program runs in less time (I know that doesn't sound possible but it runs more efficiently).
I'm still learning all it will do, and I'm glad I made the change.
Haven't found any hates yet.

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Leo
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by Leo »

Thank you - that is helpful.

I would like to hear more.

Anyone with Mach4? Do you like it? Do you hate it?
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by Rcnewcomb »

I'm running WinCNC and like it quite a bit.
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by TReischl »

Leo, if I were in the mood to swap out my Mach 3 I think I would go with the Acorn stuff from what I can see. I would buy the controller and the pro version of the software. Not exactly sure WHAT that "software" really consists of though. They are downright vague on the website about it. So I would call them and ask "What does that stuff do exactly?" Maybe I am missing something. . . .

I have no doubt that programs will run faster than on Mach3. Probably mostly due to the type of acceleration/deceleration used. Mach as you know is a straight line acceleration. About the worst form of accel on a machine. An "S" curve or other types of mathematical curves are much better. Essentially the straight line is bad because at the get go there is a lot of inertia to overcome. If accel is set too high it results in lost steps even though once past that initial inertia the motor could run much faster. So that is what the "S" shapes do, reduce initial start inertia and braking inertia, but allow the motor to achieve higher speeds. This stuff has been around a long time, first encountered it on an ANCA 2000 control back in 1980.

Every now and then I think about swapping out, but then I decide it is just not worth it for what I do and how much of it I do.
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by IslaWW »

Ted, Leo, etal....
The software "levels' with Centroid CNC12 control software work similar to what Mach did in the old days. There are 3 of them. Free, Pro and Ultimate. Free will allow a user to fire up a machine and cut files, but there is a file size limit. Pro removes that limit and adds numerous features, axis pairing, independent autosquare, 4th axis rotary to name a few. Among others, Ultimate adds built in on screen digitizing for more advanced machinists and the ability to export or cut using the digitized files.

There is also a Vectric gadget that imports and converts a Centroid "digi" file into 2D vectors.

I have been a Centroid approved Acorn 4 system builder for close to 4 years and the vast majority of customers have selected the "pro" level for their controls. So many that I have it as "standard equipment" on my Acorn 4 and Acorn 6 packages.
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by Leo »

I am not a software savy kinda guy. I am a user puerly. I do understand some of it, but I would call myself less than amature. G-Code - sure - I have done that manually for decades.

With Vectric 3D carving and a TINY bit over the last 12 - 15 years. Mach3 has been my goto in my home shop for those 12-15 years.

In industry I have used Fanuc, Okuma, Yasnac, Brother, Haas and a few others on CNC grinding machines.

As a "user" I would consider myself a professional.

I would like MacroB - but not willing to pay for it.

I have a full rotary axis drive in my control cabinet, my Y axis has 2 stepper drive motors, Z axis one motor, X axis one motor

I know mach3 is an older technology. I know Mach3 is parallel port driven - BUT - I am driving my BOB with a USB cable. There is some sort of parallel-USB software emulator to allow Mach3 to drive the BOB with USB. I do experience issues that I believe are caused by that interface. I want to get past that.

I have a Mach3 BOB. It is Chinese made and I just don't trust it. I don't think is it causing issues, BUT, if I am going to upgrade, why not just go for the gold?

I know that I am having issues to get max speed on 3D carving with Mach3. As I am getting better at 3D I want to get a better control of the electronics / Software so I can maximize my carvings.

I know how to adjust motor tuning and general configurations in Mach3. The best I can come up with is a compromise of Feed / Speed --- Acel / Decal --- quality of cut --- machine being very jumpy, by trying to feed so fast with rapid axis direction.

I have nice strong NEMA 34 steppers on all axis's. I lost steps on Z only one time in a Z retract motion. The machine is ALL welded steel construction and I would call is VERY VERY rigid and robust. Not like a Mazak, or a Nakamura or Okuma - but on the hobby to light commercial level - very robust.

So - I am looking for something to compliment the machine.

Mach4 ---- I know people are using it --- Any comments??

What is a GREAT - BOB. I am thinking CNC4PC as I had one on my other machine and was very happy with it.
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by mickecarlsson »

I am using UCCNC with the UC300LPT controller connected to a Geckodrive 540.
Went from Mach3 to this setup.
You need a controller with a license and the UCCNC software.
You will find more information here: http://cncdrive.com/products.html
I purchased the Screenset 2017 that has a lot of macros and a nicer layout of the screen, but it’s not needed.
Latest official version is 1.2049 and there is a test version 1.2115
The license is tied to the motion controller.

It runs smoother than Mach3 but there is one annoying feature that I have not (yet) solved and that is if you use ramping in Vectric is is really slow when carving.

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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by FixitMike »

mickecarlsson wrote:
Tue Nov 16, 2021 5:38 pm
It runs smoother than Mach3 but there is one annoying feature that I have not (yet) solved and that is if you use ramping in Vectric is is really slow when carving.
Are you aware that any ramping in Vectric products will move at the lesser of the Feed Rate and the Plunge Rate? If the plunge rate is slow, so will be the feed rate whenever there is a Z movement as part of the tool motion.
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by garylmast »

I know mach3 is an older technology. I know Mach3 is parallel port driven - BUT - I am driving my BOB with a USB cable. There is some sort of parallel-USB software emulator to allow Mach3 to drive the BOB with USB.


My very first CNC machine had mach3 with a parallel port and that's why I sold it. I've been using Mach 3 with a USB cable ever since. You may consider changing out the control board (which I did once), which is very inexpensive (around $30) and easy to switch out.

Gary

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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by mickecarlsson »

Are you aware that any ramping in Vectric products will move at the lesser of the Feed Rate and the Plunge Rate? If the plunge rate is slow, so will be the feed rate whenever there is a Z movement as part of the tool motion.
THANK YOU for that advice. I will try it out tomorrow.

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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by adze_cnc »

FixitMike wrote:
Tue Nov 16, 2021 5:50 pm
...ramping in Vectric products will move at the lesser of the Feed Rate and the Plunge Rate?
Unless it's changed in v10+ ramping uses the "plunge rate" only. As a test I set the "plunge rate" to 150 in/min and the feed to 100 in/min and created a profile toolpath around a rectangle with smooth ramp.

Code: Select all

N155 G0 X-3.896 Y-3.896 Z0.780
N175 G1 Z0.750 F150.0
N180 G1 Y-2.896 Z0.375 
N185 G1 Y-1.896 F100.0
N190 Y4.079 
N195 X4.779  
N175 & N180 are the ramp to 0.375 deep and N185+ is the cut at depth.

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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by Leo »

I am well aware of the plunge moves and ramping.

It doesn't matter what BOB or control software is being used. Nothing in control or BOB will have any effect there.

This thread is about BOB and control software.

Also, I am not looking for the quick cheap easy way out.
I am looking for the best way and most robust way out.
I am willing to go $500 - $700 to upgrade.

I want to feel the pain ONLY once - and be DONE with it.

I really would like to hear from an actual Mach4 user!
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by IslaWW »

"As a "user" I would consider myself a professional.

I would like MacroB - but not willing to pay for it."
You may want to look at Centroid's Advanced Macro Programming. It may do even more than you remember from the Macro B days.

https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_di ... amming.pdf
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Re: Changing BOB and Mach3

Post by Leo »

Gary, I will look at that.

I used MacroB on fanuc machines to create "family of parts" for industrial use.

One such MacroB program was on a 12 axis Maier swiss turning machine. There was a "Z" axis on the main, and a sub "Z2" axis. The main rack had a "Y" and "X". The Main turret (not rack) had live tooling and static tooling and worked on both the main spindle as well as the sub spindle. There was also another turret that only worked on the main spindle. Main and Sub also had "C" axis. On that machine there was not many limitations. On this machine I made one program to make well over 100 varieties of the spindle in a drop indicator. All of the varieties had "something" different. The operator would enter the part number and the program selected the correct variation of G-Code to run the particular part. There were "if-then" - do while, nesting, subs, If-variable is equal to, - not equal - etc and lots of other BASIC type logic built in. There were interference issues to contend with between the turrets and spindle,

I have made MANY such Family of parts programs.

Now, retired, no longer in the industry, I will never do that again - at least not to that degree.
I LOVE that sort of logic programming.

I want to play with it on my machine at home.

At some point I want to play with LUA as well.
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