3D Segmenting

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mfirlott
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3D Segmenting

Post by mfirlott »

Have been playing with new feature and I've come into a problem I cannot seem to resolve. I did not see any mention of it in the video tutorial.

I imported a dragon whose wings are swept outwards then segmented out (isolated) the left and right wings. In both Edit and Layout I cannot seem to orient them to a flat position so it would lay flat onto the wood material. The segment stays in its original orientation and no matter how much I re-orient it, it never goes flat. Please ignore the dragon body...haven't worked on it yet.
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by garylmast »

Looks like the new version eliminated the Interactive Rotation that was a feature in Version 10 and earlier. I'll have to play with the new version to see if I like it better, but from what I see so far, I don't think I will. Don't uninstall the older version just yet.

Gary

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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mfirlott »

Thanks Gary. Let me know what you find when you get a chance to have a look at it. I did not uninstall yet. :)

Would be nice that once I have a part segmented, that I could interactively rotate it. In my example, no matter what I do with the Orientation Arrows, it never takes a flat perspective to the plane. It's always at an angle to it. The tutorial uses a very simple Seagull model that does not suffer from this. It would be the same if you did a person or action figure with their arms in any position other than at their sides (like the seagull's wings). You would end up machining them end face on or at some strange angle.

Thanks.
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by Leo »

I have a similar "future" project.

I have an Osprey with wings, body, feet - much like the dragon. I am hoping to make it to mount on my machine that I call Osprey.

Following this thread should prove to be interesting.
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mohamed »

garylmast wrote:
Wed Jul 28, 2021 7:07 pm
Looks like the new version eliminated the Interactive Rotation that was a feature in Version 10 and earlier. I'll have to play with the new version to see if I like it better, but from what I see so far, I don't think I will. Don't uninstall the older version just yet.

Gary
This feature is still there but presented more simply as controls in the 3D view which you can use straight away without the need for the old radio buttons.
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mfirlott »

Unfortunately the 3D controls only manages the segmenting plane, not the object itself. Which is what is needed.
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mohamed »

mfirlott wrote:
Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:28 am
Unfortunately the 3D controls only manages the segmenting plane, not the object itself. Which is what is needed.
Indeed, but I believe / thought he was referring to this feature being removed (which is the interactive rotation of the model as a whole). Please see the screen capture for how it's done in 10.5 vs 11.0. I realise this doesn't solve your actual problem, but I was merely clarifying that point.
Capture.PNG
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by ayah »

The orientation options for each segment in the Layout mode are determined by the initial orientation of the model as well as the slice planes used to produce the segment in question.
Changing how the model was initially oriented in the Import 3D Model > Transform step so that the principal directions you are interested in better align with the x,y,z axes may help, however it is true that for more complex models such as the one in this post this may not always give the desired result unless the model is imported multiple times.

We are currently in the process of improving this aspect of the process, thanks for bringing it to our attention.

If you would like more advice related to your specific stl file feel free to send the file to support@vectric.com and we can take a look.
Aya

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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mfirlott »

Thanks Aya. Happy to hear you are looking into this. Orienting the segment once segmented is what’s needed. Otherwise, like the dragon, only models without appendages sticking out can be done (like an action figure with arms at side of body like the seagull’s wings in the tutorial).

I had the same issue with a horse model whose tail was sticking upwards and bent. I could not get it to lie flat on the plane. It rotated and oriented itself around its original orientation but would never lie flat.

Thanks again.
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by garylmast »

The orientation options for each segment in the Layout mode are determined by the initial orientation of the model as well as the slice planes used to produce the segment in question.
Changing how the model was initially oriented in the Import 3D Model > Transform step so that the principal directions you are interested in better align with the x,y,z axes may help, however it is true that for more complex models such as the one in this post this may not always give the desired result unless the model is imported multiple times.
I've never had a problem with the old way of orientation. I don't care if you add more features, but don't take away features that work. Don't force people to use 3-party software that use to work in Aspire before the change or force importing the model multiple times.

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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by Adrian »

garylmast wrote:
Thu Jul 29, 2021 1:39 pm

I've never had a problem with the old way of orientation. I don't care if you add more features, but don't take away features that work. Don't force people to use 3-party software that use to work in Aspire before the change or force importing the model multiple times.

Gary
Did you see Mohameds reply ealier? Orientation is still there it just happens in the 3D window rather than having to toggle buttons.

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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by garylmast »

Did you see Mohameds reply ealier? Orientation is still there it just happens in the 3D window rather than having to toggle buttons.
Yes I did see it. Maybe you should try to orient a 3D object in the 3D window and see if that solves the problem that is first addressed in this post.

Gary

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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mohamed »

garylmast wrote:
Thu Jul 29, 2021 2:15 pm

Yes I did see it. Maybe you should try to orient a 3D object in the 3D window and see if that solves the problem that is first addressed in this post.

Gary
Correct! It doesn't help with the problem first addressed in this post exactly as I said above. I'm merely trying to correct a misunderstanding. Take care :)
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by mfirlott »

Aya...I see 2 possible ways to allow for what would be needed to correct this issue.

1) As already noted in my original post...after a segment is done, allow for further rotation of the 3D object so can align it to the x,y,z axis of the material. Now it will be properly oriented so the next planned segment can lay aligned to the x,y,z axis of the material.

2) I tried what you noted using multiple imports of the same model but that didn't work. I segmented the left wing first and in the 3D view, I hide the rest of the model leaving me with only the left wing component. Then I import a new copy of the model and segment the right wing and import it and hide the rest of that model. So far so good...I have 2 wings. Now when I import a 3rd copy of the model, this is where it fails. I have no reference point as to where I segmented the wings so it's a guess and for sure the wings do not align properly to whatever segments I make for the body. Not to mention the file bloat from loading the same model 3 or more times. Maybe, if I could have a checkbox or similar switch to say do not re-import this part of the model (as I'm happy with it and its orientation) and when Aspire goes back into the segment view, go to the object orientation page, not the segment page, so I can have the opportunity to re-orient the model to align the next segment to the material's x,y,z axis.

Just thinking out loud here...in my mind, option #1 would be the easiest for the end user to manage.

Thanks again...
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Re: 3D Segmenting

Post by ayah »

Thank you for the update and for your suggestions; we're currently in the process of looking into an improvement for this so that orienting the segments can be done in a way that is as straightforward as possible for users
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