Decision Time...

[badgersurfer]

I have a couple of Stepcraft 420 CNCs and make very fine inlays. Up to now I only have Vcarve Pro 9.5 which is excellent for the jobs I do, but I want to create 3D wooden creations from photographs I take. For example I would like to create a 3D head of a Wooky type creature which would only be 40mm square. I have played with Aspire 9.5 Trial and definitely need to develop my skills with it, but I am getting models pretty much how I want. But what is holding me back is the price. To upgrade it will cost me £960.00 UKP. To me this is a serious amount of money. So my question is, is it worth it or is there a better cheaper solution?

[TReischl]

Interesting question. I am sure you know that no matter who you hear from it will be an opinion, no more, no less.

I have worked with quite a few different modeling packages in my quest to find one to suit my needs. I am still doing most of my modeling in Aspire, especially if it is something organic like your Wooky head. And especially if it is a relief type of model.

Just the other day I read in another forum where a poster was recommending packages like other software, Solidworks and Rhino. The person obviously never tried to do an organic model in other software or he would not have mentioned it. I cruised over to YouTube to watch a video on a person doing an organic model in SolidWorks. It has been a long time since I worked with it. Sure enough you can do organics in it. But holy smokes! I watched for ten minutes as he set up two rail sweep, then went and did the same thing he was doing in Aspire in about a minute. Rhino is a serious modeler, no doubt about it. One of the things a lot of folks forget is that Aspire is not just a modeler, it also comes with tool pathing. From what I have seen of Rhino I am not willing to fork over about a $1000 at this point. And then, from I can tell I would need to fork over another $1500 for a plug in for Rhino milling. Of course I could import into Aspire or Vcarve and do the posting.

So, no I do not think there is a better and cheaper option out there, at least not for me and what I do.

[martin54]

As Ted has already said any answers you get are likely to be just peoples own personal opinions & unless someone has a good working knowledge of different programs & how they work the opinions will probably just reflect the program they use.

Why are you running 2 machines? Is it because you are a business & sell what you create? If you are then you need to look at it in terms of how much more money you are likely to make rather than just the price of the software, where do you see the business going in the future?
I know a couple of guys who run Production Shops, they have spent 10s of thousands on software to be able to do the kind of work that they do. Both of them have said exactly the same thing in the past, for any type of organic work Aspire is their go to software. One of them actually calls it " Arty Farty stuff"

I only really have experience with Aspire but based on the support I have had from Vectric, the tutorials they provide & this forum I think it is a difficult program to beat.

If you have downloaded the trial, played around & have reached the stage where you are reasonably happy with what you are creating then I would say go for it, especially if it is a business.

[mickecarlsson]

I have the same dilemma, I have a CNC 6040 (Chinese router) and I have bought Vcarve Desktop (9.5) and I am really satisfied with that software. However, I have now come to that point that I am very comfortable with the software and my machine that I want to do more 3D and modeling. I have watched a lot of videos and I have played with the Aspire trial and I have made my mind up, I will fork out the €1600 and upgrade to Aspire, but will wait until version 10 is out as I am still saving up the € to be able to do the purchase.
I use Vcarve and my router for hobby only, all my work so far have been gifts to person near or dear to me.
I wish that there were an Aspire Desktop with a little better price, but I guess that there will be no such thing.
Just my two cents.
Mikael

[martin54]

I have the same dilemma, I have a CNC 6040 (Chinese router) and I have bought Vcarve Desktop (9.5)

Give it a little more time & the next upgrade will be a bigger better router

Yes I guess it does seem like a lot of money if you are using it for Hobby use but for me it would depend on what I got out of that Hobby. I know a lot of people who would spend more than that on their chosen Hobby, maybe not all in one go but certainly money spent over a period of time.
I use to do a lot of fishing (coarse fishing) & probably spent more than that on fishing poles alone, add up what I had spent in total over a few years & its a frightening amount of money

[badgersurfer]

Thanks for all your input, I figured by what I had watched that Aspire was probably the best route. I think mainly because it is a complete solution and a very easy learning curve.
I have been playing around with the trial and by watching a video from an Australian guy who created a basic model similar to what I want to achieve, I managed to create a basic model of what I wanted in about 20 mins.
I totally get the comment on business profit, but like anything in business it can be a punt and 1000 pounds is still a lot of money if it doesn't make the grade.
In fact it would be really useful if Vectric would add the capability to the trial version have up to 3 chances to output the gcode so you can check out the results properly on you machines.
As with waiting for version 10 I have varying views on that. I say if you want it, get it, as you could a very long wait and most companies will give you a free upgrade if you purchased within a year. I seem to remember Vectric did this from 9 to 9.5. But don't quote me on that.
So to summarise all your very constructive comments you have fullfilled all my aspirations, so I will aspire to Aspire. (Oops was there a pun in there?)

[Adrian]

Don't forget that as a business it's not really 1,000. Depending which country you're in and your type of business structure it would be depreciated over a fixed period in your accounts and/or count as a payment from income before tax so would be the amount minus your tax percentage.

[TReischl]

Thanks for all your input, I figured by what I had watched that Aspire was probably the best route. I think mainly because it is a complete solution and a very easy learning curve.
I have been playing around with the trial and by watching a video from an Australian guy who created a basic model similar to what I want to achieve, I managed to create a basic model of what I wanted in about 20 mins.
I totally get the comment on business profit, but like anything in business it can be a punt and 1000 pounds is still a lot of money if it doesn't make the grade.

In fact it would be really useful if Vectric would add the capability to the trial version have up to 3 chances to output the gcode so you can check out the results properly on you machines.

GCode is rarely, and I mean RARELY, an issue with the software. As for results? Those are more dependent on your machine and tooling than anything else. There is something else to consider. Aspire programs literally thousands of machines every day, often times multiple programs per day, for over 12 years that I know of now. In other words, its gonna work.

As with waiting for version 10 I have varying views on that. I say if you want it, get it, as you could a very long wait and most companies will give you a free upgrade if you purchased within a year. I seem to remember Vectric did this from 9 to 9.5. But don't quote me on that.
So to summarise all your very constructive comments you have fullfilled all my aspirations, so I will aspire to Aspire. (Oops was there a pun in there?)

[Adrian]

In fact it would be really useful if Vectric would add the capability to the trial version have up to 3 chances to output the gcode so you can check out the results properly on you machines.

You can save the gcode for the tutorial projects and many of the free projects as many times as you like to try out the code on the machine.

[badgersurfer]

In fact it would be really useful if Vectric would add the capability to the trial version have up to 3 chances to output the gcode so you can check out the results properly on you machines.

You can save the gcode for the tutorial projects and many of the free projects as many times as you like to try out the code on the machine.

Yes I am aware you can save gcode for the tutorials and with regards to the previous post saying "it's gonna work", I am not saying the program isn't great. I have found several bugs (as with any programs) that I have posted to the support. The problem I have is that my application is different than most as I work within a work area of 60x40mm or 25x25mm. So to create a 3d relief that is only in some cases 5mm x 5mm it would be nice to see the finished item. I don't doubt the program capabilities as scale in most cases is irrelevant.
If it had the option to generate gcode for just a couple of your own designs thus using your own postprocs, would be a real asset in my view and easily achievable for the developers.

[Jim_in_PA]

I started with VCarve Pro when I bought my machine a little more than a year ago. It did everything I needed while I was learning and developing both my skills and my business. In January, I had the opportunity to score a very lucrative job for some architectural embellishments for a custom home project but it was necessary to take design elements from photos and create a bunch of artistic appliqués. The upgrade to Aspire was a no-brainer because it provided the ability to do what I needed to do. That one job paid multiple times the cost of the software and I had no material costs because that was provided by the client. I've found a lot more things since then that have benefitted from the capability that Aspire brings to the table. Yes, the $1300US isn't chump change, but one job that is made possible by the upgrade can more than pay for that initial outlay. Depending on how your business taxes work in your geography, that cost may be offset in other ways, too.

[TReischl]

In fact it would be really useful if Vectric would add the capability to the trial version have up to 3 chances to output the gcode so you can check out the results properly on you machines.

You can save the gcode for the tutorial projects and many of the free projects as many times as you like to try out the code on the machine.

Yes I am aware you can save gcode for the tutorials and with regards to the previous post saying "it's gonna work", I am not saying the program isn't great. I have found several bugs (as with any programs) that I have posted to the support. The problem I have is that my application is different than most as I work within a work area of 60x40mm or 25x25mm. So to create a 3d relief that is only in some cases 5mm x 5mm it would be nice to see the finished item. I don't doubt the program capabilities as scale in most cases is irrelevant.
If it had the option to generate gcode for just a couple of your own designs thus using your own postprocs, would be a real asset in my view and easily achievable for the developers.

If you want to see results on small, tiny, itty bitty work look at some of the post that ScottP55 has put up. He works well below your envelope and gets stellar results. That should boost your confidence level quite a bit.

There is a danger when a person wants to do it his way and is just starting. He may not have enough skill and understand the techniques to produce excellent work. It is literally an amateur evaluating something he is not thoroughly skilled in. I have seen people claim something is a piece of junk when the real problem is themselves. Not just in the software world either.

[badgersurfer]

If you want to see results on small, tiny, itty bitty work look at some of the post that ScottP55 has put up. He works well below your envelope and gets stellar results. That should boost your confidence level quite a bit.

Yep that is interesting I would be interested to see other peoples work in my sort of envelope. I have tried to find some of ScottP55 posts as you suggested but cannot seem to find any posts with his work examples. The only post I can find is within answers to questions from other users. I was using the standard forum advanced search but couldn't see an option to search by user. Do you have any pointers to his work?

[martin54]

If your logged in & click on his name it should take you to his profile, one option is to search his posts

This is one I found but there are a lot of others & some with a lot more small stuff

http://forum.vectric.com/viewtopic.php? ... ny#p235179

[badgersurfer]

Oh also perhaps someone can help me with this problem. I have created a 3d carving from one of my photos and initially it is something like what I am looking to do. But I cannot seem to find the process to cut the material from the edge of of my image to the outside of the material. i.e. I want the image to stand above the surface not sit below it. I have done it with a shape from a tutorial I watched but the image bitmap doesn't seem to have the same options.