What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

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T4 Concepts
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What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

Hello all,

I thought I knew the basics after watching dozens and dozens of tutorial videos, but I always seem to get different results than in the tutorials. I'm really lost with this, I can't even 'draw' a simple circle! :cry:

As I need help I'll try to explain what I'm trying to achieve .............. I'm using a modified Workbee 750x750mm CNC machine, modified by myself for a particular task ( Z height has been increased ).

My first vector design is very simple, just a 94mm circle on a piece of 3mm thick ABS plastic W157mm x H155mm. I was planning on just 'scribing' the circle using a very small V-bit ( just using the tip basically ), for testing purposes.

After entering all the necessary information into Vectric V-Carve Desktop ( recently updated to v11.005RC ) as shown in the various tutorials I've followed, I'm getting really strange results in the 'Preview Toolpaths'!?
Capture.PNG
After setting my 'cut depth' ( scratch pass ) to a mere 0.2mm from the surface of a 3mm thick piece of material, it's wanting to cut all the way through the material, and my CNC machine!?
Capture2.PNG
Where is it getting that 'Maximum Tool Depth' 175.140mm data from?


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T4 Concepts
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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

Just a quick question guys if I may ................

Do all Post Processors 'know' the bed of your cnc machine?

As an example of what I mean, if the standard 'OpenBuilds' CNC machine once assembled has a maximum Z axis travel of say 175mm, will this be taken into account when creating your Toolpaths?


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gkas
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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by gkas »

Why don't you post your crv file so we can take a look at it. If it's too large, then put it on Google Drive, or Dropbox, etc. They all have a minimum free setup.

Right now, I'd guess you're trying to Vcarve the circle. With a single vector, it'll cut until the bottom of the V is reached. You most likely want to cut the single line with 2D Profile with the Machine Vector 'ON the line'. This explains Vcarve: https://www.vectric.com/support/tutoria ... bulls-head. Just because you're using a Vbit, it doesn't mean you always want to Vcarve.

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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

Hi gkas, and many thanks for the tip :wink:
Yeah, I watched that video ( again ) this morning. Watched a few others since then, just in case I'd forgotten something.
I even changed my Post Processors to see if the results were different ............. same thing again!
I just can't understand where it's getting a depth of 174mm !? :(

The part I want to Vcarve is 3mm thick, but it's set ontop of a 'jig' that's 124mm high.

How do I insert a .crv file please?


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martin54
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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by martin54 »

What is it that you are trying to achieve? Looks like you are using a Vcarve/engraving toolpath which is probably the wrong type of toolpath for what you want to achieve. Not sure what you want to do but you probably should be using a profile or pocket toolpath but without knowing more its hard to know for sure.
As for tutorials, look at the official Vectric tutorials, most have files you can download & use to work alongside the video which helps you get things rignt :lol: :lol: :lol:

If you feel the vcarve/engraving toolpath is the right one for the job then you need to tick the flat depth box & enter your flat depth figure in there.

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Adrian
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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by Adrian »

T4 Concepts wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 8:06 am
How do I insert a .crv file please?
Same way you attached the photos on your first post. Choose the CRV file and attach it in the same way. It should be well under the upload limit with such a simple file.

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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

As gkas suggested I have now got myself a DropBox account :wink:

I was really really surprised at the file size, I just can not comprehend why the file size is 280MB in size !?
It's a simply 2D drawing of a circle, what Vcarve generated I have no idea!!!!

Hopefully this link will work as I'm not fully up to speed with using dropbox as I've just created the account.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jjoz96ga5hq3o ... s.crv?dl=0

I'll fully explain Martin on my next post what I am trying to achieve. I warn you, it's not the 'norm' ! 8)


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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

Adrian wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 9:59 am
T4 Concepts wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 8:06 am
How do I insert a .crv file please?
Same way you attached the photos on your first post. Choose the CRV file and attach it in the same way. It should be well under the upload limit with such a simple file.
I checked-out some other members posts where they included .crv files Adrian .............. theirs seem to be around 1MB in size.
Mine's 280MB for some reason !? :?


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Adrian
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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by Adrian »

It's behaving correctly. If you just want to scribe the circle then you need to use a profile toolpath not a v-carve one. A v-carve toolpath will produce a cut with sloped sides as deep as it needs to reach a point which is exactly what you're seeing.

The file is so huge because of the number of toolpath steps required to reach that depth.

As Martin says if you really want to use the the v-carve toolpath then you need to specify a flat depth as you have no inner vector to constrain the cut depth.

From what you said in the first post a profile toolpath set to be On the vector with the cut depth set to be how deep you want to scribe is what you need though.

The circle vector is also duplicated.

EDIT: Just looked at the toolpath in bit more detail. You're not understanding what start depth is. It's not the cut depth. It's where the cut starts in relation to the top of the material. There is no cut depth on a v-carve toolpath. You want a profile toolpath with a start depth of 0 and a cut depth of 0.2 to do what you want.

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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

You're right Adrian ..................... I'm not understanding what's going on! :oops:
For the simple reason that no tutorial has been done about what I'm trying to achieve with my machine. I built it with a specific reason in mind, in my next post I'll upload some photos so everyone can understand what I need to do.

I'm obviously missing something!

I'll carefully go through what you mention above, no doubt I'll learn something from you guys.



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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by gkas »

Here's the 'on the line' profile cut.
Profile - On Vector - 94mm circle, scratch pass.crv
On The Line
(77 KiB) Downloaded 62 times

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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

If anyone really enjoys a challenge ................ here's one! :lol:

Here's what I'm making. I vacuum form these on my vacuum forming machine using 3mm thick ABS plastic. Up until now I have been cutting-out all those holes by hand, but as I need to make hundreds of these it's obviously a much better idea to setup a cnc machine to do it >
IMG_2662.jpg
This image shows my 'setup jig', I thought I would start off easy, by cutting out that circle that I've indicated with a white piece of paper. The toothpick setup in my spindle is just for testing purposes. The actual V-Carve bit I want to use is the tiny bit ( 3.175mm ) you see in the shot >
IMG_2658.jpg
Just a close-up, with my metric ruler to give it scale >
IMG_2660.jpg

So how would you guys go about doing something like this?



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Adrian
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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by Adrian »

It's just a simple profile cut. Draw the circle and use the profile toolpath. I would use a small end mill for that rather than an engraving bit as well unless you need the cut to have an angled side.

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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by T4 Concepts »

gkas wrote:
Mon Aug 02, 2021 10:32 am
Here's the 'on the line' profile cut.

Profile - On Vector - 94mm circle, scratch pass.crv

WOW! ................. that is impressive gkas :wink:
And you did it sooooooooooo quickly!

I've been at this 'circle' thing since yesterday ................... haven't been to bed yet!
That is exactly what I have been trying to do.

Thank you so much sir.
I've already made a few copies of that file, now I can go back and re-examine what you did and try to understand how you did it.


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Re: What on earth is going on? really stuck, need help!

Post by Adrian »

Watch these tutorials - https://www.vectric.com/support/tutoria ... -toolpaths

They cover the basic 2D toolpaths including the profile ones. I can't emphasis enough how important it is to spend time with the tutorials and don't move on until you understand the concepts. You're going to frustrate yourself enormously if you try to run before you can walk.

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