Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

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scottp55
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Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scottp55 »

So the Story begins :)
IF you're not partial to long-winded,tangential stories...Stop Here!

So..Last November I was thinking of a good sized 3D for my Mother,
and had a preliminary file made for a good size chunk of Birdseye Sugar Maple of a Seaside Fishing Village, and she liked it!
[12.17.19 MAPLE SEASCAPE RENDER.jpg
But 2 other projects got in the way for a timely Christmas present and Mom was getting wishy-washy about the model.
A week before Christmas she said she changed her mind about the model.....and the internet search began for;
"a boat seascape...you know, maybe a Maine Windjammer....or a big sailboat...or a Tall Ship...or a fishing village....or a lake camp with canoes......................." :o :o

I must have sent her 2 dozen model pics and she kept shooting them down.
THEN a member of the forum linked to a 3D site https://3dwave.org/product-category/all/....
And they had CRITTER models!! :)
Also had 2 that were "maybes" for her....and for some reason I added the "Filling Station" with the Antique Harley;
2020-01-19 14_05_10-LAKE – 3dwave.org 3D STL Files for CNC.png
2020-01-19 14_07_30-LAKE HOUSE – 3dwave.org 3D STL Files for CNC.png
2020-01-19 14_10_25-FUEL STATION – 3dwave.org 3D STL Files for CNC _.png
AND got an Immediate response...."The THIRD ONE!!!! Why didn't I thing about Harleys!!" :) :)

To understand that response a little.....Mom is the girl in the middle of the sidecar with my Gramp driving;
LATE 30'S GRAMP SCHOTT JR MOM BEBE.jpg
Picked out 3 different pieces of Birdseye for her to choose from...turns out the big one was too heavy, as her 88yr old hands are giving her problems...
SOo the middle piece it was;
2.8.20 Harley blanks.jpg
Turns out that she wants a major dedication to her Father on the back of it....
But that's the Next story :D
scott

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scottp55 »

Had to check a .25mmTBN Finish Finish cut that's 30% done at 1:30.00 time..cutting well :)

To understand why she liked it so much, and why it's dedicated to her Father.....You have to back to 1919.

Lewiston,Maine is about 10 miles as the crow flies from Poland Spring, and the IN thing to do was to dress in Sunday Best and take a ride
to the Poland Spring Hotel and see all the Fancy cars and motorcyles of the Boston folk who came to take the Waters.

So Gramp bought "At age 17, he bought his first motorcycle, a little Cleveland, for $265" and now HE could go!! :)
That August, all dressed up in his best(although a little dusty and muddy from the dirt roads) he came to the Poland Spring "Hill" just before the Hotel....
For that hill you had to put his bike in First gear...and run alongside the bike to make it up the hill.

So as Gramp told it.."There I was running alongside my bike,and getting my clothes all sweaty pushing......and I heard a noise behind me....Chug Chug CHUG...
And there was my older brother SITTING on the brand new, new-fangled TWO cylinder Harley he had JUST picked up that morning...
And as he sped up the hill...He yelled over his shoulder "See you at the top Emil" I HAD to get one of those!!!

At that time you had to buy 3 Harley-Davidsons to become a Dealer....so he and his best friend saved for 2 years, and at the end of 1921 placed their orders for 2 1921 versions for themselves...and a 1922 to sell :)
With the profit from the third bike..he bought out his friend...his Father let him used the one car garage as a shop...And Schott Motorcycle Supply was born in 1922.
Kept the business going during the Depression as he also got a job at a roofing company next door that he worked for for 70 years:)

SOoo Mom was raised proper, BUT was surrounded by motorcycle fanatics :)
AND earliest memories were in that sidecar, and remembering soft drinks at the Filling Stations on their long Sunday rides.

My Uncle George lovingly restored Gramp's first Harley;

Anyways....Now I had the model she loved...the right piece of wood.....and preliminary cut times that worked so well for me on Tiny projects......22 HOURS!!! :shock:
And that was just the last Finish cut!

Doug(Xxray) had asked me if I was going to separate the font in the sign, and do that section 2D.....Probably not..as the person who did the model probably had an Antique Sign he was working off....AND it looks as I remember(more important..as MOM remembers)....
AND with a 30 Engraving bit it previews Clean....so I had to reconsider my strategy!
1.28.20 small mom's Harley.jpg
1.28.20 small mom's Harley 2.jpg
I had never messed with Shopbot's VR settings for 3D as my stuff is Small to Tiny usually, and I was getting good results, but 20 hrs, time to Tweak!! :)
Spent 2 days running Air Cuts of small sections of Sleeping Angel and Mom's Harley with both 1mm and .25mm TBNs.
All the way from Brady Watson's Standard 3D Tweaks;

http://www.talkshopbot.com/forum/showth ... via-Tuning
BRADY'S VR TUNING 3D FILLIN SHEET.jpg
....to some of his more Aggressive Tweaks at various Feeds, and filled 2 pages in log book of actual cut times/scale factors, and got 20-40% reduction in times.
Most aggressive I got sounded barely usable with spindle and music off on some of the .25mm toolpaths(wings/feathers, and abrupt Z moves and stops:(
So cut Feed back and they were livable. Wondered if all the sudden moves would transfer into cut...They did!! :(

Didn't want to test on Mom's piece of Birdseye, so I took that smaller piece for test cutting, made the inscription on back slightly ambiguous....
2.9.20  HARLEY BACK DONE  2jpg.jpg
And IF it turns out well...will go to my Uncle who bought the Harley Franchise from Gramp when he turned 80 and ran till he sold it in 2005(?)...84 years in family:)
His 70'th Birthday is coming up.

Tried the most aggressive setting with the 1mmTBN(short one) at .22" depth, and time was Great...the cut was NOT :(
2.9.20  SMALL HARLEY FRONT 2 1MM ROUGH FINISH AGGRESSIVE 1.jpg
Out of pics I can show...on the next one....
Attachments
1921 HARLEY.jpg
scott

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scottp55
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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scottp55 »

So for second .2456" of model I backed off to Brady's Standard 3D Tweak with same bit/ Feeds and speeds(IPS 1.5, 1.5, 17K 7% step) on the 1mm.
MUCH smoother, and nowhere near the Fuzzies and wood fiber tearing out :)
Running low on my SD card, so only took picks after I stiff brushed it...and soft brush had some Linwax Butter on it...but that's all I did;
2.9.20  HARLEY FRONT 1MM ROUGH FINISH DONE 1.jpg
2.9.20  SMALL HARLEY FRONT 2 1MM ROUGH FINISH AGGRESSIVE 1.jpg
Today's one of my "Short Days"(have to quit at Noon)....so left machine and control computer on last night after chucking the .25mmTBN all Zeroed out.
WAS worried I'd oversleep, as Default settings showed a 9:50:00 cut time, and Brady's Standard showed 7 hrs.....
I needn't have worried..at 3 am we must have had a warm wind, and all that .25" ice from the storm started falling on the 33' greenhouse glass and steel roof!
You'd have to be dead not to wake up to THAT racket!! :)
2.8.20 ice storm 0 ICE STORM  DAWN BACKDOOR.jpg
I slathered up the piece with a thick coat of LinWax (Linseed oil/Beeswax 80/20) and it started at 4:30am....50% done now at 4 hours,
BUT it's the first full piece, and has reached the full .46" Z height section, as well as the engine and the lettering(It WAS ahead of schedule at first..may be again).

Hard to see, but I've brushed of small sections REAL quick...and cut looks Good! :)
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 50 PERCENT 4 HOURS.jpg
There WILL be sections to be run with the Onsrud 30 degree Engraving bit with .005"flat...but I'll have to creep up on those tomorrow after determining vector boundaries.

Has to stay on machine till then, but will show pics today when brushed off.
For those that listened to me ramble....Thanks!
scott

4 hours to play with Mom's bigger piece file, now that I have fully finished material size and inscription.
scott

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by WNC_Ed »

Scott, I really enjoy seeing your projects and and "project progress" pictures.
This project looks absolutely spectacular!

It's wonderful to have a true artist / craftsman share their strategies and thought process for working out the fine details of a project. - Thank you!

But I have to say I enjoy your background stories and your taking us along on your trips down memory lane even more.
Thank you and please keep it up!
Maker of sawdust

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by dah79 »

I slathered up the piece with a thick coat of LinWax (Linseed oil/Beeswax 80/20) and it started at 4:30am....50% done now at 4 hours,
BUT it's the first full piece, and has reached the full .46" Z height section, as well as the engine and the lettering(It WAS ahead of schedule at first..may be again)
Scott,
So enjoy following your post with such great detail! I am sure you have mentioned it before, but what is the main purpose of the beeswax mixture used during the carve? Does it help with the fuzzies or is it more of a lubricant?
Neat model, I am sure your Mom will be very happy with the results.
Dave

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by Savannahdan »

Wish I had known about the Harley shop when I lived in Maine. I rode a Honda 450CL and Norton Commando 850.

Anyway, enjoy reading through your current project and background of family. Reading your posts is very mesmerizing and kept me from getting into the shop as I had intended. Plenty of time for that. Does the butter concoction help with the cuts?

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scottp55 »

Aah...at least an audience of two like Stories:)

Gramp had wonderful Early Day motorcycle stories.

"Boston was a favorite weekend "Run", once you hit Portland...TAR road ALL the way...you could get up to 40(mph)!!!"

Another story only told after drinks with his buddy who went with him,
was the had the SWIFT idea of going to Florida with the Harley with the sidecar....During Hurricane Season!
Trip down was good and they argued over driving....Trip back in wind and downpours....arguing that it was NOT time for them to get their head out of the sidecar!! :D
Arguments over a few drinks.....neither ONE of them drove their fair share! Ruined all their brand new Leathers too!
I'd hate to imagine some of the roads they took!

Dave,
We used to put either Lacquer or Shellac(thinned 50/50) on all our button blanks as we had less tearout, but fumes in small shop were bad if we couldn't open the door.
Then experimented with the final Linwax button finish we used, and it cut as good or better after 24 hours.
THEN we were rushing and didn't have any cured....so put a thin coat on and cut....and it cut BETTER:)
So on long 3D Finish cuts(when roughing had already exposed new wood and all other sides were Linwaxed) I started slathering the cut so no dry wood was exposed,
and to thick for it to dry out on long cuts.....gave me a BETTER cut!
Not REALLY sure why....but I never run DC for Finish toolpath anyways usually....and all the "Butter" seems to collect all the dust, and makes a nice "Slurry" to rub in and let sit for 20 minutes after the cut...then brush off, and usually a sand-free finish, AND it already has it's first coat on it:)

Doesn't really seem to work for Partially Air Dried wood...don't know that either.
As you can see..no method, just changes in stages...and go with what works :)
I THINK it's something like the difference between a dry shave...and using shaving cream(?)

WISH I had thought to copy that file cutting so I could start on Vector boundaries for the Engraving bit :oops:
scott

SO sorry to keep you from shop Dan :) Did that answer the question?
scott

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by Savannahdan »

I peaked through the door and the shop is still there. I get to it after a few other chores. Need to make some cleaning cuts on a couple of stacked boxes and finish sanding on an oval box.

I have a couple of files I want to do and noticed you using the butter while making cuts. It makes sense that it would help with the cuts. I'll have to work up something. I do have some woodturning abrasive paste that I made in December, guess I could try some of that.

Have a great day!

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by rtibbs »

Well done Scott and a great story

Ron

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by highpockets »

Scott, thanks sharing the story, it's always interesting to hear the story behind the projects you work on. You are a true craftsman.
John
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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scottp55 »

Thank you all very much!
Cut took 7:52:30 for the .25mmTBN..so here's the Scale Factor adjusted close;
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 04 TIME.jpg
Took MUCH longer than however I had it figured last night at 9 :oops:
Running late....so only a couple shots shrunk to fit....stiff brushed/medium brush/soft brush/90 psi to clear the letters and spokes and such...
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN untouched.jpg
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN MIX BRUSHED OFF.jpg

Only finish was oil pressed out of the Tiny chips.
More pics tomorrow maybe.
My penny went AWOL..so it's a dime:)
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 0.jpg
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 01 CLOSE.jpg
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 1.jpg
Gotta run..hour and a half late:(
scott

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by mark-s »

Great work Scott, love seeing your work, nice, clean, and interesting.
Thanks for sharing.
mark-

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins..

Post by BillK »

Scott,

That came out great! What a detailed model to carve. Excellent back story. Such was the way of the world for enterprising people back in the day.

The oiling definitely makes the cutting better. This is an old trick used when you cut threads in wood. Try to cut it dry and you’ll get all kinds of breakage and tear out rendering the threads useless. Soak the same part in oil (linseed or mineral) overnight and you get a perfect cut. I had to plane the top of my tail vise just a little to bring it flush with the bench top after I had oiled it. The cuts were beautiful, almost translucent shavings with no tearout. So on a microsurface level with a TBN you’re getting great cuts.

Oh, you must of forgot you loaned me your lucky penny. Used it for a photo earlier.

Congratulations on a great piece of work.
BillK
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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scotttarnor »

This so cool that you have a story to go with a project!
Love the picture of the carve with all the chips basically staying in place with your mixture on it, I need to try that !

Cant wait to see the final project !
Scott T

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Re: Mom's "Harley" Saga begins...

Post by scottp55 »

Thanks all! :)

But spent a few hours going over it closely yesterday am, and think that even though I left machine running and door open to shop to minimize temp and humidity changes between 9pm and beginning cut at 4:30 am....outside temps went up from 0F to 40F and bone dry to rain from when initial set up was done.
And inspecting with 3X visor and getting calipers out...it looked like it moved about .005" in a -Y before .25mmTBN run was done :(

WAS going to run the Onsrud 30 degree engraving bit with .005" flat as it accentuated the cylinder fins, the gas pump panel, and crisped up the Font visibly.
BUT cylinder head is only .5" tall(and fins I couldn't even get an accurate measurement with calipers), and pump panel is only .3" wide.
And was afraid if I was even .005" off, I could eliminate the spark plug wires totally..and make fins and panels worse :oops:
I wasn't firing on all cylinders myself yesterday(tired and a 2F fever:(.......so didn't even dare attempt to crisp up the font :oops:
2.10.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 03.jpg
2.11.20 SMALL MOM'S HARLEY .25MMTBN 02.jpg
Looked for a sharp defining point, so I could Nudge X,Y by thousandths to register 0,0 exactly, and then test in a spot I could see in wheelchair, and then cut in a spot not critical.....BUT all I did was go crosseyed and have BP soar so I had to lie down or fall down:(
So just hit it slightly with heat gun to bring excess up....spread with soft brush...let it reabsorb....then last night gave it a penetrating Pine Rosen coat....
Earthpaint Pine Rosen/Earthpaint Linseed/ D-Limonene (10/40/50) to to drive oil in as far as it could go, and Rosen makes grain Pop a bit.

Stiff brush may have been a mistake, as it lifted fibers in tiny details...only medium brush and Star brand horsehair brush when I do Mom's!
ALSO will go straight from Rough Finish 1mmTBN, to starting the .25mmTBN cut immediately(and not sleep for 6 hours) on hers.

THIS one only had the equivalent of a .01" Allowance...probably up that to .015-.02" for Mom's 40% larger piece...also will wait for brand new bits that will be here any day now. I think I'll take this on off the machine now and not take a chance on mucking it up....will STILL make a good gift for my Uncle :)

Thanks for that Oil explanation Bill!
I thing for Mom's, I'll make up a 50/50 Oil/thinner mix to drive oil into the 1mmTBN cut(babysit dry spots for 30 minutes) and then thick slather it with butter and cut.

MAY try that with a scrap of Maple with a thin slice of Mom's models at 2IPS(this one was 1.5 IPS all axis) with this less aggressive VR setting...
I didn't try that combo in my testing....and Mom's is showing 16.5 hours with this full carvings Scale factor. So with Roughing, it's STILL a 24 hour day :( :(

SO...GLAD I did this small test piece! I Learned a bit about larger cuts:)
scott

OH...cut across the grain for all toolpaths.
scott

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