V carve flat area removal

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wcw7398
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V carve flat area removal

Post by wcw7398 »

I'm carving a fairly intricate v carve and need to remove a substantial amount of flat area. I'm using V Carve Desk Top v9.5. When I check the box that allows for flat area removal bit selection the calculate button goes gray indicating that for reasons I'm not understanding I can't use this operation.

I've done this many times before on other projects. By way of troubleshooting I have tied selecting different bits for both v carving and flat area removal but the result is the same. I've also changed my depth of cut to see if that changed anything, but it did not.

There is no way I can remove this much flat with a v bit. As you can imagine, 115 hours is time prohibitive

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Rcnewcomb
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by Rcnewcomb »

A screenshot and/or the file would be helpful to diagnose the issue.
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adze_cnc
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by adze_cnc »

A screenshot showing this happening after you select you flat clearing bit would be most useful.

The Calculate button does become disabled when I select the flat area checkbox but it is immediately restored once I select a flat clearing bit.

ezurick

Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by ezurick »

Is it possible that the tool you are selecting for the flat area removal is too large for the area? Normally the program would just warn you and remove the toolpath for that tool. But I've never seen the calculate button grey out. I am kinda new, so that doesn't mean it can't.

wcw7398
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by wcw7398 »

I'd like to apologize to all of you who took the time to respond. I've been out of pocket for a while and couldn't readily respond.

After reviewing your comments I went back and reworked my steps. Alas, operator error (read as nincompoopery) was in fact the culprit.

It seems to me that in the past when I have chosen the flat area clearance option my previous selection was used as a default and I have simply gone about my business. Now when I choose it there is nothing selected and the compute option is grayed out until something is selected. In short, it's working perfectly. I must have either mis- remembered or am completely mistaken. Both options are highly plausible.

Thanks so much for help and taking the time to respond. I appreciate it greatly and will try in the future to be a better forum attendee.

JoelWeisbrod
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by JoelWeisbrod »

Attached you will find images of the issue I am having. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Basically, the V-bit seems to have done the job but the end mill doing the flat clearing has left many ridges and irregularities. The third toolpath is to cut out the sign from the board but I have not run that yet. When I ran the first 2 toolpaths, I ran the Carve toolpath first with V-bit first and then the Clear toolpath with the end mill.

Notes:

The project looks great after viewing all tool paths.
I made sure to set the zero point at the top of the board before running each of the 2 toolpaths.


Thanks in advance…
Attachments
After running the Carve toolpath and then the clear toolpath. See the ridges?
After running the Carve toolpath and then the clear toolpath. See the ridges?
How it looks with View All Toolpaths - Looks Good
How it looks with View All Toolpaths - Looks Good
This is the Main Tool path Setup. It creates 2 toolpaths - The Carve and the Clear
This is the Main Tool path Setup. It creates 2 toolpaths - The Carve and the Clear

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Rcnewcomb
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by Rcnewcomb »

Possibilities:
  • the end mill slipped in the collet
  • the router slipped in its clamp
  • wrong procedure for Z-zeroing the end mill
After the second toolpath was complete did you verify that the Z position was still correct?
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JoelWeisbrod
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by JoelWeisbrod »

I am fairly sure the router did not slip and the bit was really secure.

As for the Z-position, as I changed the bit from V-60 to the end mill, I moved the router to the exact top of the material and reset the zero position on the CNC.

Should I have run the clear tool path first?

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scottp55
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by scottp55 »

Are you Z-Zeroing the bits at the same Exact spot each time?

If the spoilboard hasn't recently been skimmed/clamping pressures/wood not surfaced by your machine,etc.
Can cause discrepancies if not Z-Zeroing all bits in the same spot.

Varying opinions on which toolpath to run first...but do Not think that's the issue here.
Is the board flat on the spoilboard and Well clamped?
(board will move as material is removed if not Firmly clamped down, and bits exert pretty good pressure)

What method of Z-Zeroing are you using?

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TReischl
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by TReischl »

The ridges only appear to be on the bottom (y axis?) of the carving. They are also very even. Leads me to think that the machine lost steps on the y axis.
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JoelWeisbrod
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by JoelWeisbrod »

scottp55 wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 12:39 pm
Are you Z-Zeroing the bits at the same Exact spot each time? YES, I THINK SO!

If the spoilboard hasn't recently been skimmed/clamping pressures/wood not surfaced by your machine,etc.
Can cause discrepancies if not Z-Zeroing all bits in the same spot.

Varying opinions on which toolpath to run first...but do Not think that's the issue here.
Is the board flat on the spoilboard and Well clamped? YES, FLAT AND TIGHT
(board will move as material is removed if not Firmly clamped down, and bits exert pretty good pressure)

What method of Z-Zeroing are you using? MOVE TO CORNER AND SURFACE OF BOARD. RUN THE FIRST TOOL PATH. AFTER THE FIRST TOOL PATH, THE MACHINE RETURNS TO 0,0,0.5. SINCE I NEED TO CHANGE THE BIT, I RAISE A LITTLE AND THEN CHANGE THE BIT. THEN I MOVE THE ROUTER DOWN UNTIL THE TIP OF THE BIT IS AT THE SURFACE OF THE BOARD AND RESET MY XYZ TO 0.0. NOTE THAT I NEVER CHANGED THE X,Y BECAUSE I AM GUESSING THE CENTER OF THE V-BIT IS THE SAME AS THE CENTER OF THE END MILL

Welcome to the Forum! :) THANKS!!

JoelWeisbrod
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by JoelWeisbrod »

TReischl wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:09 pm
The ridges only appear to be on the bottom (y axis?) of the carving. They are also very even. Leads me to think that the machine lost steps on the y axis.
Yes, you are right. Not sure why it would miss any steps????

Also, if I carve these animal elements into the board, there is all kinds of detail. When I make them above the carved surface they are flat without detail. Not sure why that happens either.
Annotated Detail.jpg
If you look where I have added some arrows, these things don't seem right either.
On the left: What causes the 3 gouges on the left of the animal?
On the left: Why does the V-bit cut three tiers on the letters and animals?
On the right: What are the mounds between the first 2 letters?
On the right: Why does the V-bit cut three tiers on the letters and animals?

Why don't these anomalies show up in the software previews?

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Adrian
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by Adrian »

They don't show up in the software preview because they are caused by hardware issues on your machine.

The tram lines on the angled side of the carving are usually because the spindle/router is not plumb with the surface being cut or because a different bit to the one programmed is being used.

The mounds are areas that should have been cleared by the v-bit because the endmill was too big to reach. Are you 100% sure that you're using a v-bit with the same angle as the one you've programmed?

Why is the preview mirrored compared to the actual cut? If possible could you attach the file so we can see how you've set the job up and defined the toolpaths etc?

JoelWeisbrod
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by JoelWeisbrod »

Adrian wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 3:14 pm
They don't show up in the software preview because they are caused by hardware issues on your machine.

The tram lines on the angled side of the carving are usually because the spindle/router is not plumb with the surface being cut or because a different bit to the one programmed is being used.

The mounds are areas that should have been cleared by the v-bit because the endmill was too big to reach. Are you 100% sure that you're using a v-bit with the same angle as the one you've programmed?

Why is the preview mirrored compared to the actual cut? If possible could you attach the file so we can see how you've set the job up and defined the toolpaths etc?
I'll check to see if it is plumb. Yes, I am using the exact tool I chose in the software.

Yes, I am using the 60 degree v-bit

The NextWave SD 120 does not have a post processor to do the invert and flip and uses reverse axis design. Lots of us have complained to NextWave but they think Vectric is wrong. Funny huh? They tell everyone to just flip and rotate before carving and it works although it is a PIA.

File is too big to send here. I am happy to send via an email downloadable site if you send me your email. Send it to me in a private message.

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Adrian
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Re: V carve flat area removal

Post by Adrian »

You can attach links to cloud services here. Most people use dropbox or google drive to share files. It's best to share it here if you can then you get the input of multiple people. Many times there's been an issue that lots of people have missed but one has spotted it.

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