Complete Newbie Need Help

Topics related to wrapped rotary machining in Aspire or VCarve Pro

Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Sun Mar 06, 2016 12:18 am

I have read and tried things until I don't know where to go. I want to make X which is my Gantry across the table axis, my rotary. So I want the X to wrap to A PP correct? I cant get any movement at all when I load a file. I can get the X to jog, or the rotary motor. I have checked the settings page where I ad the 0.0001 value to Z I have checked the rotational axis page under toolpaths menu. Anyone want to offer any suggestions I would really appreciate it. Thanks
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Rcnewcomb » Sun Mar 06, 2016 1:00 am

What machine do you have?
What control software are you running?
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Sun Mar 06, 2016 6:13 am

I have a CandCNC electronic controls and I am using Aspire with Mach. The CandCNC has X Y Z A and a HW axis. I can slave the HW to the X or Y and in my case I have it slaved to the X so I can just unplug the X motor wire and run just the HW motor. I just cant figuure it out. As I said ealier I can make it jog but when I try a file I get nothing. Y and Z will move but X or the HW nothing.
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby TReischl » Sun Mar 06, 2016 4:02 pm

It would help if you posted a bit of the cnc code from the beginning of the file. Make sure it shows us some A axis commands. Probably about 50 lines or so.

If your rotary is turning when you press Jog, that is good news. If so, you probably need to do some more settings in Mach.

There is a thread on this portion of the forum that is pretty good explaining the settings in Mach.
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby garylmast » Sun Mar 06, 2016 8:31 pm

Maybe this thread might help you.

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=22837
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:27 am

Thanks for the thread reference. I have been reading all I can. I played with some settings this evening and was able to get the X axis which will be my rotary to move. It wasn't until I change the values in the box under the MIDI screen.(see pic) What I will do is unplug the X axis motor when I run the rotary. As I said I have a odd setup for a router from CandCNC, its designed for plasma. So I have a HW (Hard Ware) motor output that is slaved to the X, so the X and the HW turn now, the HW will be my rotary. I just have to figure out now how to setup the motors and what to type into the box in the MIDI screen. Am I on the right track? Thanks for everyones help!
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby garylmast » Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:47 pm

I bought a CNC, where you had to unplug the X-drive and plug the Rotary drive into it. I had to keep changing all the settings in Mach 3, back and forth, depending on what drive I was using. Capturing a screen shot for each setting and printing it out for reference helped. I hated that machine so bad, that after a few weeks I sold it and bought another one that it had the separate A-drive. Definitely a good idea to reference the settings for each drive. Gary
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby TReischl » Mon Mar 07, 2016 5:00 pm

I do the plug/unplug thing, but I created a rotary profile in Mach, so all I have to do is click on which profile I want to use. No need to change a bunch of settings.
http://www.tedreischl.com

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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:20 pm

I just have to unplug my X. I have 5 motors and 5 outputs. I have X Y Z A and HW (Hardware). Right now my A is slaved to my Y and HW is slaved to my X. I didn't want to bother the A since it slaves with my Y, so all I do is unplug the X and I am good. Also I use 2 different Mach. In the above picture does anyone know what I enter into that box? Would it be the diameter of my material? If so Do I have to enter it every time?
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby garylmast » Tue Mar 08, 2016 7:57 pm

My Mach3 is different, where it doesn't show the Local System Rotated Box. If you go back to the thread I posted, the Wrapped Job Setup in Aspire is where you determine the diameter and whether you wrap the X or Y axis (Where A replaces the axis you choose). When it is saved to the PP and opened in Mach3, your diameter will be set. My guess is the "HW" drive is causing you the problem, where Aspire wants it to be "A". The speed and degree of movement will be setup in the Axis Motor Movement Profile in Mach. But after saying all that, your Mach is different, so referring to my setup may be different than yours. Gary
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Thu Mar 10, 2016 3:35 pm

Ok I got the machine doing what it is supposed to. Now I have to fine tune everything. I ran a simple zig zag cut file down a 12"X2" round cylinder and it works great, just turns too fast. Also the great news is I don't have to unplug or replug any wires. I just use a different cloned Mach program with different settings. I have had this machine since March of 2012. Its high time I got the rotary working. Thanks for everyone's help. I will probably have other questions later. :D
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Sat Mar 19, 2016 12:54 am

Ok I got everything going great , except motor tuning. Could someone please help me with the math? Here is what I have all that I know. I have a 6:1 ratio pulley, meaning the motor turns 6 times to the pulley once, I assume that's correct. The specs on the motor all I can find says , Nema 23 2 Phase 57 step motor, Step angel = 0.3 degree/step. I dont understand how to apply the below formula to my setup. Any help would be appreciated?

Multiply that by whatever "micro steps" your stepper driver is set at. Lets assume ten micro steps for example.

200 x 10 = 2000 steps per motor revolution.

A 10 to 1 gearbox reduction. so 2000 x 10 = 20,000 steps per axis revolution.

Divide that by 360 to give steps per degree. 20,000 / 360 = 55.55555 Enter this number in Mach3 "steps per unit" for A axis.


Thanks in advance!
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby IslaWW » Sat Mar 19, 2016 3:21 am

Jeff...
This should get you close :) 1/10th microstepping is not listed, as I never use it, but if you use it, 200 steps/degree (unit)

1200 step 6 to 1.JPG
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby ger21 » Sat Mar 19, 2016 2:40 pm

I've never seen a stepper with 0.3°/per step.
Standard is 1.8°, and high res is 0.9°.

It wasn't until I change the values in the box under the MIDI screen.(see pic)


Local system rotate is rotating the X and Y axis around the Z axis, and is not what you should be doing to get your rotary axis to work. You'll notice that the X and Y DRO's have turned red, telling that you are no longer using a standard coordinate system.
Rotating it 366° is really just rotating the coordinate system 6°. What this would do is cause the axis parallel top your rotary axis to no longer actually move parallel to the rotary axis, causing everything you cut to be skewed by 6°.
Further more, I believe there is a bug in Mach3 so that when you are in G68 mode (rotated coordinate system), when you jog, it doesn't jog in the rotated coordinate system, but in the default coordinate system.
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Re: Complete Newbie Need Help

Postby Jeff Johnson » Sat Mar 19, 2016 5:37 pm

motor.PNG
This is the specs from the motor, all that I have. I do know the driver microstepping rate is 10 , I have a manual that came with my electronics controller from CandCNC. So would this be correct for me? ,(assuming my motor takes 200 step per rev. ,10 being my microstepper rate) 200X10=2000, ( 6 being my reduction ratio)2000X6=12,000, 12,000/360degs=33.3333333333
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