Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

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Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Sun Mar 31, 2019 12:17 am

Hi, This has probably been answered a dozen times, but I can't find the solution. I have two files made in Vcarve, front and back sides. I now have Aspire, and want to combine these into one two-sided file. When I try to add the backside file to the front side file. The thickness are the sum of the two files, but what I want are for the two models to be on the opposite sides of the same material, as if I was simply turning it over and running it with the second file, as I would have done in VCarve. Obviously, I am new to Aspire, but these seems like something that should be easy to do. Meanwhile I've burned up a couple of hours trying to do it. Can someone please explain!?? Thanks!
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby Phil » Sun Mar 31, 2019 3:20 pm

You haven't provided much detail on how you went about your work in Aspire. Have you tried setting up the Aspire file as a two sided file? There may be other issues but this is a good place to start.

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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:49 pm

Sorry, I didn't see any responses until just now.

Yes, i understand the use of two-sided models. The problem is I was given some VCarve one-sided files for a part. Each contains a 3-D model, but VCarve won't accept two models, so the originator made one file for each side. They work fine, but require me to really spend a lot of effort trying to line things up during editing and just in general, I want to combine these into one two-sided file.

When I make a two-sided model, it adds the thickness of each to the new model. I can't get an "import" of anything to actually show any difference, so I tried doing a copy function. This works fine, but as they are both around 20mm thick, so instead of getting one 20mm thick object, Aspire wants to create a 40mm thick object. Merging doesn't work on two sides, only on one. I tried merging the two together, but could not flip the backside to point "down", so the models overlap on one side, rather than one side pointing to the bottom. Trying to set the backside model into the front side model in the material setup doesn't seem to do anything.

There really isn't much more detail than this. Two files, made in VCarve, each one-sided with a model. The original intention is to make one object (in this case a guitar neck) of the right thickness (20mm) out of the two files. I want to combine the two into a single model of an object 20mm thick. Aspire gives me a two-sided model, but it adds the front and back model to a common reference plane, and the resulting model is 40mm thick.

So, the question, how can I tell Aspire that the second file is side 2 of the first file and integrate them into the proper size?
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby TReischl » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:58 am

Howzabout you open up one of the one sided files in Aspire in two sided mode.

Then open up another session of Aspire, load the second side file into that one.

Flip the first session to the opposite side.

Copy and paste the information from the second file/session into the first one?

Not sure this would work, but I see no reason why it should not.
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:26 am

That's one of the things I did, it makes a 40mm object, it does not embed the second side into the first side to make a single 20mm deep object.
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby TReischl » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:36 pm

I dunno, it would seem to me that if you put two 20mm models together they become 40mm thick? Makes sense to me.

You are asking the software to perform what is known as a boolean operation.

It would probably help a lot if you could post a couple of screen shots of the original models so we can see what you are trying to do.

I tend to create a simple example to think about. For example, I have a 20mm thick disk that is 5 inches in diameter as one model. The other model is 7 inches in diameter and 20mm thick. If I merged them into one model exactly what is the software supposed to do? The 5 inch model would be inside the 7 inch model if the final model was to be 20mm thick.

But let's say the original 5 inch disk was only 10mm thick sitting on top of a 10 mm thick base. And the 7 was the same way. The trick is to get rid of the base material below 10mm. That can be done by exporting both files as stl's, then when they are reloaded use the slider that allows removing material below a plane. Maybe that is what you would like to do?
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:55 pm

Yes, this would be similar to a boolean OR operation to merge the one file down into the second file. In 2D, this is called "welding" by Aspire.

I can't remove material from either model, as both extend essentially all the way to the bottom of their respective sides. This is a guitar neck, as I said before. One side has the curved back of the neck on the "top" and the other has the headstock shape and truss rods on the "top". The models don't overlap in the real world, so there are no cut throughs, except along the edge, as desired, and I can carve them, with some challenge, as separate files. While I don't really care which one I start with, I want to merge them together to form one two-sided file of the correct thickness. If I remove 10mm from either side, or if I reduce their heights, I will distort or damage the features I need, which need to be accurate to within a mm.

"The 5 inch model would be inside the 7 inch model if the final model was to be 20mm thick" - this is exactly what I want to do (only in my case, both front and back would be the, let's say, 7 inch disk.)

Aspire can merge two shapes in 2 dimensions on either side by welding (which is what I'm more or less trying to accomplish), can it do the same thing in 3 dimension front and back?

I've attached a picture, shown in 3D, from an oblique angle, showing the part twice as thick as required, with a plane separating front and back. I want the plane of the front side lined up with the face of the back side, and the plane from the back side to line up with the face of the back side.
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby mtylerfl » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:02 pm

Perhaps the following video tutorial "Making a Guitar Neck" will be helpful:

https://www.vectric.com/vectric-communi ... =1&items=0
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:21 pm

So, some progress thanks! Exporting side 2 as an STL file and importing it into Side 1 sorta seems to work, in that the models seem to be in the right place, but when I try to look at the results in 3D, it shows either the front or the back side of the models, and not both. Making tool paths works on either side, but I have to use the preview all sides option, which I don't normally have to do (or perhaps Aspire just automatically does that when the design is created all at one time?) They don't act as if merged into a single model, making alignment of the two sides difficult. But at least it's doing what I wanted. Thanks for the tip regarding STL files.
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby gregk » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:32 pm

I'm not completely sure that this will help you, but have you tried lowering the base height of the components on each side and then using Replace Below gadget to discard the part that 'sunk' below the zero plane?

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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:34 pm

Thanks, Michael, I have used that tutorial already, but making a two-sided neck isn't the problem. The problem is much more general, that of combining two one sided files made in VCarve into a single two-sided file in Aspire. I think I mostly have it figured out now, using the STL file export/import method suggested
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby relayerbob » Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:35 pm

Thanks Greg, I tried something like that, but it distorted or removed critical features
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby Rascalman » Fri Apr 26, 2019 3:24 pm

I have thought about this as a means of combining the "seahours corbel" files into one 3-D Model - would that work?

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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby mtylerfl » Fri Apr 26, 2019 4:12 pm

Rascalman wrote:I have thought about this as a means of combining the "seahours corbel" files into one 3-D Model - would that work?

Randy Reese


As long as the material is thick enough, yes. It’s really not creating them to be a “single” model. Rather, it’s dulpicating/mirroring the same model lined-up front-to-Back.

If you REALLY want or need to create a single full 3D model, you can use the model export function with the “Close with inverted front” option selected.
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Re: Combing two VCarve files into one Aspire file

Postby martin54 » Sun Apr 28, 2019 3:28 am

try adding a zero plane to both sides of the material, I had this problem when trying to create a plate some time ago & adding a zero plane to both the front & the back seemed to sort my problem :lol: :lol:
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