Flipping XY coordinates in Aspire

[SCW]

Does anyone know if there's a way to change the orientation of the XY axis within Aspire? Currently, Aspire's x-axis goes left to right on my monitor; the y-axis goes bottom to top on my monitor. My end goal is to set up the XY coordinates on my monitor/Aspire to match the XY coordinates on my CNC. Thanks.

[Mike-S]

If it were me, I'd swap the machine X/Y to match the CNC to the screen--way less confusing if you stay with conventional directions.

[Frunple]

Does anyone know if there's a way to change the orientation of the XY axis within Aspire? Currently, Aspire's x-axis goes left to right on my monitor; the y-axis goes bottom to top on my monitor. My end goal is to set up the XY coordinates on my monitor/Aspire to match the XY coordinates on my CNC. Thanks.

You're standing on the wrong side of your machine.

Seriously though, you have your machine axes set wrong, X is left to right.

[IslaWW]

From the "Basics" lesson:

[cbr_speedster]

X, Y & Z is the industry standard for all machine's... I wouldn't change it for yours but it's your machine, do what you want.

[SCW]

Thanks for the input. Yes, my machine IS set up with the X-Y zero in the lower left corner... But that means I only have 2' of travel in the CNC x-direction, yet 4' of travel in the CNC y-direction. Regardless of industry standards or other factors, this is NOT how I want to run my machine.

Most of the work I'm doing is in a landscape format and so that's why I want the x-axis in Aspire to run on the long axis of my CNC machine (currently Y-axis on CNC). Also, I'm starting to use my 4th axis with stock longer than 2'... Also, my t-rails, which I use to align my work, run in the CNC y-axis direction. So these are just some of the factors why I want to work from the long side of my CNC machine and not from the short front. If there's no way to swap the XY axis in Aspire, then I'll hit up the Axiom forum and see if I can swap the xy axis on my CNC machine.

[SCW]

If it were me, I'd swap the machine X/Y to match the CNC to the screen--way less confusing if you stay with conventional directions.

Yeah, I guess that would also get me what I need... Thanks for the input. I'll see if I can find out how to swap the axis on my CNC machine. Thanks.

[LittleGreyMan]

AFAIK, XYZ orientation is standardized in an Euclidean space, but not the origin on machines.

I disagree on this point with you Gary, having the origin in the front left corner is not an obligation nor a standard. I have an industrial machine which origin is in the right front corner, the command panel being on the front. Which means the X axis is oriented from this point to the right rear corner. And it's not the first large machine I see with this orientation.

Running machines with different orientations, I'm still wondering why this is a problem.

I'd like to have a rotation feature in Aspire but in order to orient the largest size of the job horizontally to maximize the full display size. If this feature also helps people with a "wrong" origin, so much the better.

[4DThinker]

You have two choices...

1. Swap the cables on your CNC so the long direction is the X axis stepper and the short direction is the Y axis. Then edit your controller setup to change Y values to negative Y values.

2. Edit your post processor to swap all X values for -Y values, and Y values for X values. Now despite what Aspire tells you your horizontal toolpaths will cut in the long direction of your CNC.

My CNC is also 2' x 4' with X in the 2' direction and Y in the 4' direction. It has never bothered me to lay out what I want to cut in a vertical rectangle in Aspire, as using the scroll wheel it is easy to zoom in and pan around the layout area.

4D

[IslaWW]

LGM...
I love disagreement, as it creates discussion, which is when we all learn. I did not mean to say that having the XY datum in the lower left corner is an obligation, but if the machine is built for the upper right (X pos from zero, Y pos from zero) quadrant as the vast majority of general use CNC machines are, yes it would be the standard, maybe even mandatory.

I too have used numerous machines that use virtually every corner of a machine bed as the XY zero position. I have 3 routers in my shop that use the XY zero at lower left with the long axis as Y, A mill using top left with the long axis as X and have owned 2 ShopBots where the long axis is X, XY zero is lower left, but most users stand on the left end, think it is the front and believe their XY zero is on the lower right.

Fact is that if both X and Y are positive away from zero, the table uses the top right Cartesian quadrant and the XY zero is in the lower left. The location that a mfgr or operator choses to place the operators control panel does not change this, it only changes his perspective. Rivers flow downhill. Whether they appear to flow left to right or right to left is simply perspective based on which bank you are standing on. This perspective is always subject to an individuals preferences.


There are only 4 choices:
Upper right with both X and Y positive away from zero (XY zero in lower left)
Upper Left with Y positive and X negative away from zero (XY zero in lower right
Lower right with X positive and Y negative away from zero (XY zero in upper left)
Lower left with X negative and Y negative away from zero (XY zero in upper right)

For the vast majority of CNC machines where the owner desires lower left datum and landscape orientation, which is how virtually all CNC router tables are designed, the XY zero location is in the lower left corner of the table, and if it is not, then in most cases you are simply standing in the wrong spot. These are not my rules, Mr Descartes published them in the 1630's.

[cbr_speedster]

That's the beauty of CNC.... You can set your zero virtually anywhere you want. Even at home position in the middle of space as long as you know where your part is from home... Heck, set Z zero on the top of the spoilboard where 90% of your work will sit and have all positive Z numbers.. You'd never have to set origin again.. It all depends on preference of what each individual wants.. The machine doesn't care one way or another.

[LittleGreyMan]

Gary,

I'm sorry, I don't disagree with your last post

Yes, the upper right cartesian quadrant should be standard.

But if you consider a machine with the orientation of your last slide (X gantry) and a control panel which stands along the Y axis, you cannot pretend the operator is in the wrong place when he faces this panel. It's just that your first slide presents the most common case as a rule. And I understand that keeping things simple for a basics lesson is better than being absolutely exact. "Standing in the wrong place" is probably much more meaningful for a lot of people than speaking of cartesian quadrants. Probably just quibbling.

This being said, I still don't see why the portrait/ landscape orientation is a major issue. But I understand that modifying the orientation can be handy. Ask the manufacturer, the machine controller may allow this.

Regarding the 4th axis, AFAIK its orientation is just a matter of post processor configuration. Don't worry about that as there are several rotary machining gurus on this forum and a specific section for these issues.

BTW, did you notice that nearly everybody uses its monitor with the wrong orientation for text processing without complaining?

[TReischl]

What is normally done these days is to assign the axis based on where the operator normally stands while at the control, with X zero being to the left and Y zero nearest to him/her. Think about it, it only makes sense.

Many, many moons ago Machine Shop magazine would print a CNC issue every year or so. Back then, the sages claimed that the X axis HAD to be the longest axis of travel (not including Z which is always in line with the spindle).

I sit at the right front of my machine. My monitor is in front of me, I am facing down the Y axis. This makes it easy to jog the machine with the keyboard arrows. They point in the right direction.

Curious as to where the OP has his control computer located? I get it that he wants to orient his work for the reasons stated. I probably would too. BUT, if that meant manual operations at the machine became a bit bizarre, I would be swapping those cables around.

[IslaWW]

LGM...
"
BTW, did you notice that nearly everybody uses its monitor with the wrong orientation for text processing without complaining? "

That is priceless!! I wish I had thought of that!

As a CNC service tech I am often asked to swap axis, change XY zero corners to match where a user determined where his operator panel should be. In most every case these requests come from inexperienced users. For some reason the upper left corner is the most common. Maybe the text on portrait orientation starting in the upper left corner is the reason. Don't know the answer.

Did you know that the vast majority of errors and bug reports for CAD, CAM and CNC control softwares are reported by users in their first 60 days of ownership? One would think that experienced users would find more things wrong?????


Ted...

Your comments caused a chuckle. Along with every request for an axis or datum corner change comes a "written in stone" rule such as you provided. Other than the direction of X and Y coordinate increase/decrease from zero base on a selection of quadrant, I know of no other rules. Some systems work better on a particular quadrant. My personal daily drivers are router lower left, mill upper left and lathe lower right. I could change any of them to be anything, or to be all the same, but dont because they seem to work best that way, and it "follows convention". New users that want an axis or corner swap don't realize that they will loose the ability to converse with their peers and tech support once they make the requested changes.

[SCW]

Curious as to where the OP has his control computer located?

Hopefully my pic is attached. If so, this is how I use my CNC... I'll reach down with my right hand and flip on the Variable Freq Drive; I don't manually adjust the speed so I never touch the drive again until I'm ready to shut the system off. You can see the hand controller hanging on the CNC stand (which happens to be where the machine xy-axis = (0,0). When I'm running a program, I keep the hand controller on top of the CNC table (where the wrenches are in the pic) because it's easier for me to hit the stop button if something starts messing up. I stand between the gantry and the hand controller when the project is running so that I can get in there and see the detail of the work. If I'm standing "where I'm supposed to be" on the short end of the machine, then I can't see enough detail of the wood/bit once the gantry is over 2' away. I'm still new to this and I'm still experimenting. I want to stare at the bit the whole time because i'm afraid I might have feed/speed wrong to where I might snap my thinner bits. My computer with Aspire is located in my office and I don't have any monitors or computers connected to my CNC.

I've got a couple coworkers that have one of their dual widescreen monitors in the portrait orientation... I don't do that because i can get two [portrait] documents tiled side-by-side on my widescreen [landscape] monitor.